Jonathan Van Ness (‘Gay of Thrones,’ ‘Queer Eye’) on being open to more recaps [Complete Interview Transcript]
Jonathan Van Ness is now an Emmy nominee for being a producer on the short-form variety series “Gay of Thrones.” The reality star is also a member of the Fab Five on “Queer Eye,” which won three Emmys last year including Best Structured Reality Program.
Van Ness recently spoke with Gold Derby contributing writer Sam Eckmann about ending “Gay of Thrones,” being part of positive queer representation on television and whether future recap series lie ahead. Watch the exclusive video chat above and read the complete interview transcript below.
Gold Derby: I love the series and it was I heard borne out of actual conversations that you had cutting hair. Can you just walk us through what was the start, the genesis of this project?
Jonathan Van Ness: That’s totally true and I also just feel the need to share this cute little tiny baby cat that just propped right next to me. Yeah, so I was working at a salon at the time in Venice, California and I was doing my longtime friend Erin Gibson’s hair and next to me my business partner Monique and her client started talking about “Game of Thrones” and I went into this little trance. I like to joke that it was a fugue state of recapping the show. When I came out of it, Erin’s like, “That is a series. We gotta do this for Funny or Die.” And that was how it started. That’s really how my whole entertainment career got its first experience.
GD: Looking back now, more and more stars have gotten on the show. I feel like it’s a show that people wanna be on. You have Kumail Nanjiani and Tiffany Haddish this season so is it hard to throw yourself in with a new person every week, just diving in not knowing them?
JVN: It’s definitely really helped me become a better performer, not only a better performer and a better comedian but I think it’s also, doing hair for the last 13 years of my life, I think it helped me get used to getting familiar and comfortable with new people and really learning how to bring the best out of them and work with different people just so regularly. It’s really just been an honor to get to work with so many comedians and actors and actresses who really helped me learn how to be better. It’s been such a fun learn-on-the-job experience.
GD: The turnaround for making an episode is really insane because “Game of Thrones” comes out on Sunday and then you have to recap it and it goes up Tuesday. What is your timeline like in terms of when “Game of Thrones” is, what you have to prepare and then the filming process?
JVN: The first six seasons of “Gay of Thrones” we would shoot on Sunday night and then it would come out on Monday evening. For this last season, obviously, it’s difficult to convince people to wanna come in and spend six hours of their Sunday night with our gorgeous crew. We are so fun. It’s a hard sell. So this last season, we were like, “Maybe if we shoot on Monday mornings that will help us be able to get the most fun people that we can get for this last season of our baby show.” I think that that worked. This season we did a Monday shoot so we would watch together on Sunday night and Erin and I and our other co-executive producer and our two writers, who we love so much and then our editor, John Ford, who’s incredible, would get together and watch the show together and then we would come together and write the script. Monday morning at 7, you go and it’s hair and makeup, let’s start by 8 and then we would wrap by 11 and usually, we have our first pass of the show done by about 2 and then we would be up by like midnight. We didn’t want filming on Monday morning to cause too much of a lag time so we were really, really so proud of how we were able to do that, really the whole series but especially this last season.
GD: One of my favorite aspects of the whole series is the nicknames that are brought out with the characters. Cersei’s new one, the evil no-volume Carol Brady was the top of the list for me.
JVN: Thank you, that was mine. That one was all me (laughs).
GD: I was gonna ask you, is that genuinely how you keep track of the characters? Do you come up with the names or is it collaborative?
JVN: All of “Gay of Thrones” has been so collaborative but there are certain names that are definitely ones that were like, mine, like Christina Aguilera. We have changed so many people’s different names. We’ve had a working name bible because we have just changed so many over the years. The evil Party City group, that was one of our writers Mark Rennie’s more hilarious ones. Every one of our writers and producers has made contributions that we would not have been able to do “Gay of Thrones” without.
GD: There’s obviously a script but I think part of it feels so organic and natural and conversational in that way. Do you have room to ad-lib on-set when you’re making those?
JVN: Absolutely. The first season of “Gay of Thrones,” because I was a 26-year-old hairdresser newbie, I had never been on-camera before, I was terrified of lines and the idea of doing a script for me as a performer at that time was like, “I can’t do lines, I can’t remember how I got here! I’m so scared of lines.” Then over the years, learning about editing and learning about producing and learning how content creation works, the scripting was essential to make a tight, hilarious product. We didn’t have the time to cut down all the footage of improvisation so we had to incorporate more of scripted aspect to the show. But I think because the show was so founded on an improvised feeling, that never left us. That’s one thing about Erin as a director that is so great is she always gives our person that is in the chair the room to be able to make their lines more themselves. If anything doesn’t feel right or could be made more unique or more individual or better suited for the comedian that we’re working with, we are always in a collaborative space for that, which I think is so empowering. None of us are too precious. Having that really fun, collaborative, open space to create I think is also why the product has always been so fresh and easily evolved. That part’s great. We totally have room to play. In my mind, I think we usually try to get the script clean a couple times and then we just will go. We also will improvise within the script because sometimes, honey, when that spirit takes you, you just gotta go.
GD: I’m curious too because along the way, “Gay of Thrones” has gotten bigger but then along the way you get this job with “Queer Eye” and you’re much more of a household name now. Do you think “Gay of Thrones” has prepared you for that, in a way, for that “Queer Eye” experience?
JVN: I do, but I can’t even believe I’m having the experiences that I’m having now. It’s really so surreal and it’s such an honor. I talk about that a little bit in my book, which is coming out September 24th. I think in retrospect that having “Gay of Thrones” happen… We’ve been doing “Gay of Thrones” since like 2013 so it’s been six years. It spanned all my late 20s and my early 30s and obviously “Game of Thrones” had that year off so it’s just been such an incredibly transformative time of my life where I’ve learned so much about myself including that I wanted to be an entertainer, which is something that I have always been an entertainer but I didn’t realize that I wanted to or could be one as a career. “Gay of Thrones” has prepared me so much but also, every single day, I’m so amazed by all of the cool stuff that I get to do. Honey, but also a little overwhelmed sometimes but we do the best we can. It’s just been an incredible ride and I’ve just been so thankful for all of it.
GD: Speaking of overwhelmed and speaking of crazy turnaround, I feel like every time I open Netflix or I get an email from Netflix saying another season of “Queer Eye” is ready. Are you constantly filming those at the same time as “Gay of Thrones”?
JVN: Yeah, for Season 1 and 2 of “Queer Eye,” I would fly back to L.A. every weekend. I remember right before I booked “Queer Eye” I was like, “I wanna work more. I wanna be on-camera more. I have something to say, I just don’t know where to say it.” And then I booked “Queer Eye” and a month later I was on-camera seven days a week. I was like, “Oh my gosh, queen, be careful what you wish for.” All of a sudden all of my dreams came true. That part was really interesting because I filmed “Queer Eye” for four months, from May to September of 2017 and then it didn’t come out until February of 2018 and it wasn’t publicly announced yet so it was an interesting experience to go from being on-camera that much and then going back to my normal salon and being in the salon all the time and within that time I flew back and forth to film “Gay of Thrones.” Then when we were shooting in Kansas City we didn’t have “Gay of Thrones” because that was when “Game of Thrones” was on its little baby break and then this last season of “Gay of Thrones,” I wasn’t shooting “Queer Eye” yet but I was working a lot for press for Season 3 of “Queer Eye” and then also had been in Japan and Australia. I have definitely been working a lot. Do you remember that show, the one about the behind the scenes on TV where they would follow all the fun musicians? I feel like that’s my life. I feel like Christina Aguilera in a black car going to interviews and this thing, except if Christina Aguilera couldn’t sing and was on unscripted TV and was obsessed with figure skating and had a lot of cats.
GD: Well, I think that’s a good place to be. I would say that’s a great place to be. One thing I love about both of your shows is that it’s a place with very positive queer representation. One is obviously very comedic, for “Gay of Thrones,” and the other is very naturalistic. I think we are entering a space where there’s other Emmy nominated shows like “Pose” and Drag Race.” Do you feel like you’re part of a shift towards a place where we have really positive queer representation on TV?
JVN: Yeah, first of all, I’m obsessed with “Pose” and I love “Euphoria,” which I am sure will be nominated for gorgeous Emmys next year. I’m obsessed with “Euphoria” and I do think that there’s more queer representation happening and I don’t wanna sound like a broken record but whenever I get asked this question I always just feel like for the amount of LGBTQ+ positive stories that are going on in the world now, there’s so many that deserve to be told and they’re incredible stories but they aren’t being told because they aren’t being told by people that have a certain amount of followers. That’s how things get greenlit now. No one wanted to hear what I had to say before “Queer Eye” but after “Gay of Thrones” I totally had lots of things I wanted to say that because of “Getting Curious” and “Gay of Thrones” I will have the opportunity to say now. If not for the opportunities of “Queer Eye” I wouldn’t have this platform that I do have now. There’s so many other incredible people like me that have something to say that is valid and moves the conversation forward and is important and when they go to try and get a meeting with someone in L.A. or New York, they’re looking at metrics and they’re thinking about it from this money way. I think that creativity really suffers because of the way that businesses are so reticent to take chances, especially on queer artists that don’t have a certain amount of following. I do think that we have more representation, which is important, but I really feel that Hollywood could do so much better.
GD: It’s great at least that you are a part of that.
JVN: I’m honored to be a part of that, don’t get me wrong, but I want so many more creators and artists to be able to have this platform too.
GD: Hear, hear. I’m glad you’re finding new ways to have your voice out there, like with the book you mentioned, because “Gay of Thrones” is over now because it’s one of these shows that’s tied to “Game of Thrones.” There’s nothing else to recap. Has it been difficult saying goodbye to the series?
JVN: It’s sad to say goodbye. It’s also more sad just to say goodbye to the friends on the crew that I’ve made and the conversations with other fans of “Game of Thrones” and that anticipation of what’s gonna happen in the realm and knowing how we know how it ends, it’s just like, you don’t get to talk about it as much anymore. It’s more saying goodbye to the characters and the experience of what “Game of Thrones” was for all those years that’s harder to say goodbye to but I’m really excited for what’s ahead. I think that as far as “Gay of Thrones” specifically, I’m so proud of our crew and of Funny or Die and of Erin and myself and our writers that have just worked so hard to come together every year and really just leave our hearts and souls on the comedic dance floor. I’m just really so proud of the work that we’ve been able to do.
GD: Do you think you want to leave it there or would you want to recap, like, they’re doing prequels?
JVN: I would love to do something else with that, for sure. If the prequel is lit, I’m there. We gotta see how it is. Part of what made “Gay of Thrones” so magic is that we had such a wide array of stuff to talk about to make the episodes move. So I think you would need some really amazing content but I love Erin and I love Matt Mazany and Mark Rennie and Joan Ford. Our whole team at Funny or Die is just incredible. I would love to work with them anytime.
GD: Well, I will cross my fingers for more great nicknames of characters like evil no-volume Carol Brady. But anyway, thanks Jonathan for sitting down with me. Congratulations on your Emmy nomination.
JVN: Thank you